Horses Arabian

Are crossbred horses any more legitimate as breeds than hybrid dogs?

I'm wondering if the crossbred horse breeds - Azteca, Aralusian, Appendix Quarter Horse, National Show Horse etc. - are considered to be more legitimate than the hybrid dog breeds which have popped up in the last decade or so? For instance, is a Welara Pony (Welsh Pony / Arabian) a legitimate new horse breed if it has its own association and registry? Or is it just the horse-equivalent of something like a Chiweenie (Chihuahua / Dachshund)? Does having an association and registry mean that the standards are rigorous enough so that a new breed can be established? This does seem to distinguish these new horse breeds from most of the hybrid dogs - which don't have registries.

Public Comments

1. No they are just another way that people can justify cross breeding instead of breeding pure breads together to get better horses.
2. It depends. If it is a rough cross, such as in an example that one parent is thoroughbred, and the other parent is a quarter horse, then it is not a very legit cross as its own breed. BUT if it is generations of that cross (where each parent is a quarter horse x thoroughbred cross) then it becomes more and more separate as its own breed.
3. thing is that there are horse show classes for part bred horses.. eg.. Arabian shows have classes for Part Arabians, or Half Arabians.. thus we can easily see if a part Arab mare is shown to be worthy of breeding by earning championship titles.. Typically the studs are purebreds, because there are no classes for partbred stallions most shows that I know of.. of the horses you mentioned these most now have registries... thus they can go to shows and compete to see if they are worth breeding.. there are no such shows for these mutts.. most breeders therefore breed dogs who are NOT good breeding quality, if they were good quality they would be breeding purebreds. it is a fine line - you are right. IF we started having shows for mixed breed dogs, I am sure you would see an increase in quality breeding -- but most of the public are ignorant they just want a Golden Doodle, and do not have a clue about asking to see parents pedigrees etc.. horse people who want to be competitive always ask for pedigree .
4. Horses are quite a bit different then dogs. In dogs you have a breed to do anything you want and they do it well. There is NO NEED to cross 2 breeds. They make mutts. No lagitamit registry recognizes cross bred dogs even if you are using 2 registered dogs. AKC will not except them. When you cross horses and since someone has already used this one. A registered QH (AQHA) with a TB (Jockey Club) you get an Appendix QH which is registered with AQHA and can show in AQHA sanctioned shows. Same with Arabs. There is a 1/2 Arab registry and sanctioned shows. There are set rules for each of these crosses and must be met to be registered. Same with most other crosses of 2 REGISTERED parents. Now if you are talking Grade horses with no known ancestry then that is different. Well thought out crosses with proven sire and dam gives you a horse that can excel in a given area. Each breed will bring something needed at times to the table to add to the next generation. This is not true when you start crossing dogs. You also have to understand that even with horses. Most crossed when it comes to the next generation does not sire true most of the time. This is why most of the registries who recognize these crosses will only allow you to cross back on a fully registered sire or dam and not anouther cross. Edit: Actually the QH/Arab cross is one of the better crosses. They are not at all dissimilar as long as you are using working lines in both breeds. Look at the NRHA/Scottsdale Arab and 1/2 Arab Futurities. Very nice QH/Arab crosses doing quite well in a sport that is dominated by QH
5. Brett, in my experience people tend to either feel very, very strongly on the subject of "breed-ness" (for lack of a better word) or they don't care at all. I'm pretty much in the camp that says that in selecting a horse for a specific purpose where any horse can be used, the individual trumps the breed (or cross-breed) every single time. From what I have seen, when you're breeding horses it rarely works to cross horses that are extremely dissimilar physically. This is true whether you're talking of horses of the same breed, i.e., something like a "bulldog"-built Quarter Horse with a more long-and-lean Thoroughbredy-looking Quarter Horse, or dissimilar breeds like a Quarter Horse and an Arabian. People tend to hope that the foal will be an "average" of the two extremes, but it doesn't usually work that way in my experience-- what you end up with is a hodgepodge of characteristics that don't fit together very well and don't function well. There are some crosses that work together fairly well, such as the Appendix Quarter Horse, because most of the people breeding these are breeding similar physical types-- crossing racing-type QH's with Thoroughbreds that have the same body type (the QH people tend to use sprint-bred Thoroughbreds in their breeding programs, if they use a Thoroughbred at all, and these physically resemble the QH type). Ditto for Welsh X Arab crosses, although you have to be careful, because there are different Arab physical types and they don't all work well with Welsh as crosses. The "old style" Arab, the Crabbet, Kellogg, McCoy body type, which is close-coupled, somewhat stocky, with good bone and nice Arab type but not extreme head/face, works well with Welsh crosses. Some of the bigger, rangier, longer-legged, more Saddlebred-type Arabs don't work so well with Welsh (but when crossed with Saddlebreds, you can get some stunning horses). Ultimately, for most of us who do not have an unlimited source of money, it's the "best bang for the buck" that determines what we buy, and that comes down to the individual horse that suits us best and we can afford. And that means assessing the horse as an individual without paying any premium because it's a certain cross. If I'm buying a horse for a purpose that a horse of any breed or an unregistered horse could be used for, I'm going to be looking at the best individual I can find for the money I can afford to spend, and I'm not even going to THINK about the breed.
6. Different breeds of horse - e.g. Tennesee Walker, Thoroughbred - can have completely different genes and thus characteristics. For example, some horses can only have coats of certain colors. Others naturally have a different gait. So, to answer the question, yes - usually. Because different breeds are so, well, different, crossing them makes a completely new animal. Note that a lot of the breeds considered so "pure" - e.g. Thoroughbred, Arabian, Lipizzan - were developed long ago after hundreds of years' careful breeding and perfection of bloodlines. Of course, there are points at which it just becomes ridiculous to invent new breeds because the Welsh Pony owner can't keep his Arabian mare out of the same pasture. Keep in mind that new breeds of horse are usually are carefully researched and different bloodlines are often painstakingly matched to produce the best possible offspring. This is a little different than inventing a new dog breed because the neighbor's pit bull and your doberman had a little rendezvous.
7. Nothing is funnier than someone making up some ridiculous registry to justify they're horrible backyard breeding experiment. People are cross breeding icelandic ponies now.That should be a hanging offense.
8. The "new" breeds of horse are pretty much the same thing as the hybrid dog breeds. This is a big pet peeve of mine: that someone can breed two different dogs together, combine their names in a cutesy way, and suddenly people will pay $800 for a mutt! Personally, I love mutts and actually prefer them to purebred dogs, but I'm not going to pretend they're something they're not, just so I can feel like I can brag about my fancy, special breed dog. What also bugs me is that they make up the cute name, then have to qualify it with the actual mix in parenthesis because no one knows what they're talking about! Same thing with horses in most cases. In the case of the appendix QH, you're still dealing with the QH registry, but they have a separate category to allow approved crosses. I have a horse registered as a Hungarian Sportlo, but she's actually a Hungarian/Trakhener. In the Hungarian registry, they have a category for approved warmblood crosses (Sportlo) and another one for arabian crosses.